Fitness/Conditioning

[rosenrot]

I've been thinking about the possibility of introducing an element of fitness training or conditioning into the Wing Chun sessions.

I know that broadly speaking WC is about ending fights quickly and efficiently, but you can't guarantee a confrontation will always be over after a few quick strikes. Furthermore the level of adrenaline in the bloodstream under stressful circumstances (i.e before, during and after an actual fight) can be massively draining both physically and mentally. I can't help but feel that 10-15 minutes of conditioning at the start of each session would massively benefit all students. Lets face it, we'd usually have time to do this before Sifu arrives.

The fitter we are the better we feel, the quicker we react the more powerful our techniques will be and most importantly we'll still be able to throw a punch after a few minutes of verbal and physical conflict.

I'm not talking about trying to turn ourselves into machines or being one of those martial arts clubs that people go to for fitness rather than combat, but a bit of cardio work would do us all good. There are plenty of exercises to choose from: burpees, squats, sit-ups, mountain climbers, split-jumps, tuck-jumps, press-ups, holding positions such as the ski-sit or the plank and many more. As a result performing sets of different exercises shouldn't become too boring. Examples of how to mix up and design a workout based around these activities can be found on rosstraining.com. This guy shows that no matter how little time or equipment you may have, you
can still improve your fitness.

I'm aware that this has been raised before and may have been dismissed on the grounds that not everyone at the club would be comfortable doing such workouts. This is exactly my reason for advocating conditioning. Any martial artist needs to learn to push themselves physically and mentally. Getting people who aren't used to exercise to try workouts they think they can't do, but with effort can actually manage, could be very rewarding for mind and body.

My suggestion for a typical routine would include something like this:

"Small amount of Jogging (normal, knees high and heels up)

10 Burpees
10 Sit-ups
15 Star-jumps
10 Squats
10 Split-jumps
30 seconds rest

Repeat set
30 seconds rest

Repeat set

Stretch off

Punching exercises interspersed with sets of 10 press-ups

Try and hold the plank or ski-sit position for a minute"

I've no idea how successful this would be as we've never tried anything like this, but I think some, or all, of such a routine would be manageable.

I would be interested as to other's opinions on this, especially those of other beginners.

[Tom]

I agree. Lord knows I need to be in better shape. I also think that we should maybe put a little more emphasis on actual bone conditioning too. It's all very well and good teaching people how to defend themselves, but if you ever have to, it's not going to help you at all if your hand breaks after one punch. I shattered the fourth knuckle on my right hand a couple of years ago and have been doing conditioning work on it since I started Wing Chun. Not only has this led to that knuckle now being very strong, if slightly deformed, but also the rest of the bones in my hand.

Before each session I tend to do about 5 minutes of punching the wall bag, then some more whenever I have a minute free in the lesson. Also, the padding round the wooden dummy gives excellent resistance to being hit, and is pretty close to how it feels punching a real person. I occasionally switch to just hitting the bare wall as well. This is good for toughening up your knuckles, but you have to be careful not to overdo it, as you can really hurt yourself. And a general rule to go by when doing any sort of contact punching practice, on wallbags or mitts or anything, if you're bleeding, STOP PUNCHING.

If bleeding occurs, it's a pretty good sign you're doing something wrong, so continuing is not going to help you at all. On top of which, you're going to get all our equipment all messed up.

I find with some of the beginners, or more specifically, people who have never done any sort of martial art before, they feel like they have something to prove, and as a result can often end up damaging themselves in some way. Anyone else find this?

[rosenrot]

This is true, I need to start conditioning my bones more. The only limitation at the club though is the number of wall bags with hard fillings that we possess. If we had more we could include this type of conditioning in the fitness sessions (if we have them) at the beginning of lessons.

[Dan]

both good ideas i think, an i know everyone would benifit from them.

In the past i used to do 10 measly press ups each week then 11 the next and so on for a few weeks but the ammount of stick i got for it was unreal. Some people are such lazy bastards sometimes (myself included) but like you both say it is really good for training in any martial art.

The only way to find out how it will go down with people this year is to try it i guess, so ill do a longer (cardio style) warm up next time and see how it goes. also we should think about spending the spare money in the account on some wall bags.

[superfoot]

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[rosenrot]

Thanks for that Ad....as informative as ever.

[superfoot]

ye we should give it a test run and see how it goes, also if some people prefer a lighter warm up we could have the more 'hardcore' warmup in one of the little rooms, while a lighter warm up is conducted in the LT. This way it seems everyone could be satisfied?

[rosenrot]

While this is probably the most practical option I can't help but feel it defeats the object of the exercise: to get everyone in the club fitter. If people can opt out of working hard then where's the incentive to push themselves? If some members get too tired during a fitness session to continue then they're welcome to stop and rest. Such individuals should feel pleased with themselves that they've reached that point because, with continued effort, their conditioning will improve.

As long as we make clear to people the benefits of conditioning for their self-defence, as I tried to in my first post, I don't see why club members would be opposed to such a scheme.

[Tom]

I think that depends on whether people do Wing Chun because they really want to learn self defence, or if they just do it for a bit of fun though..

Although that said, the majority of people who train are there because they want to learn. I don't think the people that just want to have a bit of fun keep coming back after the first few sessions.

[ian]

Hey everyone. Just thought I'd offer a bit of advice.

I think its good that you should be getting everyone to do general fitness and conditioning in the classes. It should always be a part of any martial artists training. However you will get people put off by stuff that it too intense. Remember that the class will have a variety of physical abilities, and not everyone will be satisfied no matter what you do. The girls for example may be ok with general cardio, but condition exercises like pushups will be harder for them.

So a general suggestion is to allow girls to do pushups on their knees etc. As long as everyone is pushing themselves, it doesn't matter how they do compared to other people, as long as they feel they are making progress themselves.

Also another suggestion. I don't know how many punches you go for in the training drills, but when I was doing it, if I was feeling mean, by the time I finished most people couldn't move their arms. So if you want to intersperse that with pushups people are just gonna give up. I would move the pushups into the general set and do punching on its own.

Doing the side plank is a good one for the trunk, but again, girls may struggle to keep it up for more than 30 secs each side.

Also I would lose the jump splits. My legs are really inflexible and I know I can't do them, and I think a lot of others couldn't either. It is dynamic stretching and you are more likely to get injuries from them aswell.

A final suggestion is to gradually ramp it up. Start off easy and as the term progresses crank up the intensity so people aren't overwhelmed at the start.

[Dan]

Thanks for the advice what you say seems to be very true.

My curent plan is to keep it all optional and i know it kinda makes the point of getting 'everyone' fit lost but im hoping that people wont want the embaresment of sitting out. and yer girls should go for the on the knees press up coz normal ones arn't good for the wombe i believe.

But i think the best way to get good at punching is to punch lots hence the recent sets up to 10 in the air and then on the pads etc. then ima just do the tip toe up and down thingys to build calf musscles and tighten the achellies tendon so people have powerful kicks and stepping.

[rosenrot]

Just to clarify: split jumps don't require good flexibility as its not the same as full splits. You just take a wide running stance and jump switching your front leg to the back and back leg to the front. Although they don't sound difficult after you've done a few squats they really tire your calves and thighs.

[Togo]

Hey, this is my first post so enjoy,

I come from a background of a few different fighting arts and i've been in a few situations in my life so far that have called for me to use my skills, not wing chun per se due to the fact that i have only been training in it for a few short months and these scenario's happened before i started wing chun but i have to say i think that had i not been as fit as i am due to other martial arts training then i would have come off a lot worse.

I know as a wing chun beginner i may not fully appreciate how the art is fully apt for the street but from all my other knowledge and common sense i can definately say that you need to be fit to fight. Damn fit. I know this is not quite the theory with wing chun but i'm going to go ahead and play devil's advocate here. Rarely is a fight ended in 3 or four seconds unless a weapon is used, in a fair fight Which isn't often) you have to be able to withstand great fatigue and pain, the stress, pressure and fear of a combat situation and also be able to hold you own. People who neglect the fitness side of combat i feel are kidding themselves on to an extent, even the adrenaline dump has it's toll on your energy levels before the fight begins. Another point is that if you are successful in defending yourself you still want to get the hell out of there asap as people rarely fight one on one these days. As my previous muay thai instructor used to say to us, if your not fit enough to run away from a fight then your not fit enough to fight.

The other point to some fitness aspects would be from a health benefit, i know people vary in age and ability and i'm not neglecting that fact, however if everyone at least tried to better this aspect on some level then i feel it could also improve some aspects of there wing chun training in class as well as there own health.

hope i'm not coming across as too much a D**k head here but i feel this is an important point, and i hope no-one thinks i'm being hypocritical with me being fairly young and havin a ok level of fitness. no one is that good that they cannot gain some improvement.

[superfoot]

I agree with phil.

Fitness is of course very important, it is however difficult when you have a very diverse class with varying levels of athleticism and fitness. Also the girls (im not sexist, my mums female) seem to find some exercises such as pressups de-feminising and refuse to do them, perhaps we need to take such factors and social norms into consideration more when thinking of fitness routines.

With all these problems it is tempting to say that people are better off getting in shape in their own time, however few people are motivated enough to do this so we should try and include a little. Perhaps those motivated enough to get fit can just push themselves more in lessons. For example, in Taekwondo, whenever my instructor asks for 10 pressups, ill do 30.

[Togo]

I fully agree that it would be hard to incorporate into the class but would be worthwhile, perhaps it could be set aside for the last 15 mins or so for those who wish to do it and for the others in the class they could perhaps do something else.

In my class there is a few people who i don't think would be too happy with press ups etc but if we made it optional then i don't think it would be too big a deal, but then again it all comes down to personal preferance, a lot of people go to martial arts and fitness classes because they can't motivate themselves, i for one find that a class helps me get into the right mindset for training.

as superfoot and a few others said i beleive, perhaps that aspect of fitness should maybe be kept outside of class for those who wish to do it, i personally have no problems with it but maybe if a few exercises where set down by the instructors in class every few months for the students to go home and practice themselves then it could maybe work ?